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2.0 Hub Driver
Hi all,
i´m going to get one of the Icm+ boxes. 2+ or 4+. Not to sure which one. This is the question. Let´s assume a setup like this:
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1 macbook pro, 1 iPad, both connected to an icm4+.
I would like to connect some midi controllers, which only have a USB MIDI connection. Lets´says an ableton push, DJTT Midi fighter..
Which different would it make if connect several usb midi controllers via
A) a active USB hub which is connected to my macbook pro
a active USB hub which is connected to the host port of the icm4+?
thanks in advance.
Comments
2.0 Hub Driver
Hi all,
i´m going to get one of the Icm+ boxes. 2+ or 4+. Not to sure which one. This is the question. Let´s assume a setup like this:
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1 macbook pro, 1 iPad, both connected to an icm4+.
I would like to connect some midi controllers, which only have a USB MIDI connection. Lets´says an ableton push, DJTT Midi fighter..
Which different would it make if connect several usb midi controllers via
A) a active USB hub which is connected to my macbook pro
a active USB hub which is connected to the host port of the icm4+?
thanks in advance.
Comments
Usb 2.0 Hub Driver Download
I think the only difference would be how you would route the MIDI to the iPad. Through the hub to icm4 you could use the icon nect configuration app to say send the midifighter straight to the iPad. If you connected to computer midi fighter would have to go to computer then out to icm There may be some latency benefits but that's just a guess. You could connect hub to computer or icm but if you want audio pass thru you can only connect icm to computer so if you use huh w icm you save a USB port.
This thread may be helpful http://forum.audiob.us/discussion/4613/iconnectmidi-4-aggregate-audio/p1
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hi there,
thanks for your quick help. Still not sure for which one to go. I mean, price is more than twice between a icm2+ and a icm4+.lets assume i would go for the icm2+. would the setup below makes sense in terms of intelligent connection/latency and what not.
edit:
the 'KA6' box would be my Komplete Audio 6 Interface, which is connected to the active hub, as well my ableton push and some other USB midi devices..Sorry if I sound like a commercial.
Even if you're using just MIDI on the iCM4+ I think things are going to pay off better from a latency standpoint. Since it works just like a network router (which basically it is), count the number of hops in communication between any two devices connected to it. Two hops in all cases (Controller > iCM4+ > Module) and processing is all done at the hardware level on the iConnect where conversely, if you were to insert a PC in the middle of your communication chain, like in your diagram, your running on a software driver level and latencies are now at the mercy of the OS as it decides on and shifts priority based on what it thinks it needs to do at any given millisecond. On a Mac/PC it's mind bending how many decisions it has to decide not to act on.
The only exception to the two hop rule is rtpMIDI over the Ethernet port where it's as many hops as the network is large and/or complicated but that's another topic.
The main reason I'm advocating the 4+ over the 2+ is the USB host jack. Just use a powered hub in combination with that host jack and start plugging stuff in. Adding stuff is easy and right out of the box you should be able to just plug everything in and it should talk to everything else connected. I also feel the range of functionality the 4+ offers over the 2+ exceeds the price difference.
Many times I don't use Audio PassThru and send audio out the various devices' analog ports to a R24. The interoperability between all the various wired and wireless MIDI transports is worth it alone. The Audio PassThru and the charging of iThings is an added bonus.
thanks for your thoughts. rtpMIDI is truly another topic, which actually i do underestimate. I´m pretty sure funny things can be done with it.
I can see the benefit of icm4+ over icm2+. The USB host jack of 4+ would be actually the point of which on the get. And, yes, as you mentioned already, i agree, the range of functionality exceeds the price difference between both devices. Is it worth to spend the 100€ more for 'just' having the active usb hub plugged straight into the 4+ vs. having it plugged into my macbook pro.
As far as i understood, the host port at the back of the ICM4+ won´t accept no audio interface which is plugged straight into 4+ or/ an active hub which is plugged into the USB host jack of a 4+, which has been discussed here at the forum already thoroughly by @ josh_icm, if i´m not wrong.
In order to use the analog i/o of my KA6 i would create an aggregate device. So, the whole point of this post arose with the idea to wait for the audio4+ device, which i heard rumors that will be released at January 2015. (Any confirmation of this is very welcome!)
I would expect the audio4+ to be price wise about 200€ more than a 4+. Which i would even be willing to wait and pay for it. For me the audio4+ is a wonderful idea to have an iOS Audio interface with analog i/o and audiopassthru and midi routing that will even charge my iOS device.!
But the downside then again is, that the audio4+ will have a switch at the back to choose between the USB host jack functionality OR the second computing device, in my case my MacBook Pro, which in that my active USB hub is connected to. Which brings my back to the same diagram and question as described above. Is it worth to wait and pay the more €s for an audio4+?
At the End of the day, the whole thing its a bit like everything else. Price related to stuff is not linear, it is exponential.
^ If the iConnectAudio is 200€ (or whatever that works out to in USD) over the iConnectMidi4+..no. Just no..the only thing my iPad setup lacks is a way to keep the iPad charged while using it in my studio. I need TRS stereo in/out, at least one set of midi in/out, and the ability to charge the device while using it. If the iCM4+ wasn't crippled in this way with Audio Passthrough being limited to only being sent to a computer, I would already own it. I'd be willing to pay up to $300 or so for a device that would do this, but even that is on the high end. $500 USD (if I've got the conversion right) or so for something that could probably be solved with a $40 adaptor is absurd. I'd rather buy a second iPad and swap devices out when the battery gets too low. The pressure should be on manufacturers to create a simple adaptor that will transmit audio and midi I/O as well as power, not to create an expensive hardware solution.
@Accent
thank you for your thoughts. Btw. The '200€' i mentioned is absolutely a personal guess! Nothing official or confirmed, to be clear.https://morlesobers1975.mystrikingly.com/blog/thinkpad-t43-drivers-for-xp. As far as i can see, i think i might give it a go with a 2+ just to start to see how it works it this setup, like the following Diagramm. I think the biggest concern would be the KA6 connected to an active USB hub to my MacBook Pro, which then i would setup as a aggregate device with the 2+.. Upgrade always an option. .
! If someone reading this, has this or a similar setup like below, please let me know!
thanks.- edited November 2014
I agree with @accent, but for different reasons. I use hi-end external converters costing thousands and I don't want the converters in these all-in-one-iOS devices. Give consumers the option to use the gear of their choice. USB Audio / USB midi / Charge the iPad.
It's so annoying having this conversation over and over again..free 'home run' advice for a hardware manufacture..
@Deb
please play nice. Everybody should be encouraged to ask their Questions.
For this Forums are made for, mate. And i´m pretty sure even your questions you posted here, somebody found pretty annoying. So, if you personally find some posts so annoying, please keep this very-non helpful information for yourself, okay?! You may find it annoying, some others not. thanks!Winrar free download. @monoaural no, that is not what I meant. I do not find any questions on here annoying. I was referring to the lack of product development. Also, my post is helpful so you please play nice.. You are welcome! ;-)
- edited November 2014
Hello again!
So I tried all of this setup and actually it works.
I have MacBook Pro with Ableton and in first port I have a powered USB hub.
In that hub I have now Launchkey, Maschine, iCM2+ and KA6. I set up Aggregate device(KA+iCM2) and I can send midi to ipad that is connected to iCM2. (with lightning to 30pin adapter->iCM2special cable, since I bought the iCm2+ when it had only 30pin cable in the box. Anyway, it works).In Ableton I can set everything up. Even my Tera synth is listening to Tempo, that I set live in ableton. I can choose different midi channels and seems to work fine. I think I can make some serious routing to set things up for good.
Now. If you ask about latency I would like to make some measurements. If anybody can name some tools for that, I'd appreciate it.
Right now the only thing missing is simultaneous charging of the iPad, but I guess I'll need to buy the adapter and it should work? I'd like a comment on that from @Josh_iConnectivity if possible. He has been very helpful and so has @monoaural. Thank you guys! - edited November 2014
and ofcourse, just to be clear, since I made the aggregate device, I have iCM2 audio passthrough coming into ableton for recording
and I am using Launchkey to play the synths..
Since launchkey has InControl, I can use it to play synths and record stuff directly into ableton and launch clips and so on.. I just might take a photo later to show the setup. - edited November 2014
@nosfe
great news. good to hear. thanks for that.regarding the charging thing: i guess the power adapter will solve the ipad charging problem. btw. USB hub wise i´m using DLink 7hub MK1 and super happy with it. It has now charging ability. the latest model though (completely black box) will provide 2 as charging connections! just to let you know.!
Always happy to hear how it goes. Keep us updated!
- edited November 2014
@nosfe - When using the iConnectMIDI2+, you will need the optional power supply if you wish to have the iOS device charge while connected to the device port.
http://www.iconnectivity.com/iCM2plus-Power-Transformer(iConnectMIDI4+ comes with a power supply, so it can charge your iOS device as well)
As far as latency goes.. the more times you go from D/A to A/D with converters, the more latency will be added to the audio. You shouldn't see much latency when routing MIDI. Most of the time adjusting one (or all) of the following will overcome the latency:
1) Change the Audio Playback buffer in your DAW's (Preferences > Audio)
2) Change the latency setting in the iOS app preferences. Sometimes this is just a low/hi setting.
3) Change the iConnectivity hardware buffering options using the 'Audio Info' panel in iConfig.
